Welcome to the KuppingerCole Analyst Chat. I'm your host. My name is Matthias Reinwarth. I'm an analyst and advisor with KuppingerCole Analysts. My guest today is Warwick Ashford. He is a senior analyst with KuppingerCole. But much more importantly, he is one of the architects, of the engineers, of the agenda of the KuppingerCole Annual Event EIC 2025 in Berlin.
Hi, good to have you Warwick. Thanks Matthias. I'm excited to be here because I'm keen to talk about this. This is a topic we've been living with for literally 10 months since the end of the last EIC. So we've been beavering away, you included, and we've been trying to put together the best agenda that we can. Absolutely. And if you're watching that before EIC, it really is a teaser for you to what to look forward to.
Keynotes, workshops, streams, topics to be covered. And if you're watching this afterwards, no worries. It is also a look back on the EIC and what to catch up with if you can get hold of the recordings of the event. So if we look at this topic-wise, what are the key topics that you would consider to be outstanding from what we did in the last 10 months to form this agenda? There's actually quite a lot. As you know, it's been quite an effort to get everything together. I think I'd start by saying really we've tried to organize the information into sort of five streams.
So we've got one on AI risk and opportunity, which I like the title of because I think this is kind of gives the dual edge of the whole AI innovation into the world today is that it's both risk and opportunity. Then, of course, we have security-related streams. So we can look at some of the topics there. And then we have trends and innovation. We're going to try and look at all the trends and innovation in the identity space. And then we've also kept with last year's formulation of inside the enterprise.
We'll be looking at the core topics like IAMs, IGA, CIAM, B2B onboarding, and that kind of stuff. And then beyond the enterprise, which I guess was also going to be a pretty interesting track.
I mean, obviously, we're going to be looking at EIDAS, identity wallets, travel credentials, and decentralized identity. But the overall kind of theme this year is pioneering digital identity ecosystems. So that's kind of not every presentation is going to speak to this.
But to me, it's one of the overarching themes or kind of the overarching theme that's going to be tying in is the idea of getting these identity ecosystems going. So that's kind of a key topic. Non-human identity is going to be an important topic this year, I think. And I've already mentioned EIDAS and the ID wallets. And then we're going to be from the AI side, they're going to be topics like integrating identity into AI. And then of course, decentralized identity, like last year, building on last year, there's going to be a lot around decentralized identity.
And I think one of the highlights there is going to be a panel discussion on the ecosystem approach to cross-border collaboration from the Asia Pacific region. And there's also going to be a panel discussion, which I think is also very important, about the business case for decentralized identity and the EDI wallet.
And yeah, I'm sure you agree that we need to find business cases for these things, because without that, there's going to be no adoption. Absolutely. I have the pleasure and I'm really looking forward to moderating this beyond the enterprise track. So this is really something that I'm looking forward to as well. And as you said, these ecosystem aspects are really getting away from well-managed, well-maintained corporate identity silos in the end to solutions that are interoperable, that work together, that are standardized, that allow for transfer of selected data from system A to B.
This is really, I think, one of the key aspects for me as well. So going beyond just one management system to, yeah, interoperability, cooperation, collaboration. And I think this is also where these use cases will have to lie to allow for these things, these trends that we just see to actually evolve and to be implemented and really tested in real life. I think this is really an important part. This ecosystem aspect being in the tagline of the overall event is important to me as well, but everything else that you've mentioned as well.
If we look at the keynotes, of course, they reflect main topics that will shape the EIC. What are the main keynotes, starting keynotes from external speakers, especially that you think are worthwhile mentioning as a teaser?
Well, of course, we kick off this year as we do every year with Martin keeping his opening keynote. And this year, he's going to be talking about the identity fabric for the 2040s. So identity fabric is going to be one of the key topics. And I know there's going to be a workshop on that. So you can talk about that in a little while now. And his keynote is going to be talking about the strategic foundations for digital identities in the age of quantum AI and decentralization.
So this is kind of insights into rethinking traditional IAM frameworks to ensure resilience and scalability and relevance in the face of technological change. So again, that talks very strongly, obviously, to the theme of pioneering digital identity ecosystems. And this is kind of really building on his keynote from last year.
And yeah, so I mentioned the workshop. I mean, there are going to be eight workshops in total. One of them is going to be the Cooping a Coal workshop on designing your future identity fabric. So maybe you could just tell us a little bit about that, too.
Yeah, absolutely. First of all, Martin has this visionary aspect. So he's looking into the 2040s, which is quite a bit far away, but we need to plan for that. If we want to plan for the nearer future, that's actually where the workshop comes in from and held by my colleague, Philipp Messerschmidt and me together. And we want to really show how we can operationalize the identity fabric and the Coping a Coal IAM reference architectures to build and evolve and create and to assess existing IAM ecosystems.
So we just did this revamp, this new version of the identity fabric and the reference architecture, which is an evolution, no revolution. And using that for really, in real life, getting to a roadmap to a plan how to improve. This is what we want to show in that workshop. And I really hope that many are attending because this is something where we give away a bit of our advisory knowledge for all the participants so that they can leverage it in their own environments. So I think that is really, really something to take away from this workshop.
But it's only one workshop, so we are competing against others. Yes. It's one of many topics. As you say, we're going to be also looking at in the workshops on how to find and educate your IAM team. And then there's building a secure AI stack for the business, which I think is going to be really interesting. We had a similar topic in the workshops last year, and that was very well attended and received.
Obviously, decentralized identity is going to be one of the workshops and privacy-first digital identities. Certification of digital credential services and passive authentication. So quite a lot of hands-on type stuff to to to get involved there now just coming back to the keynotes. I'm pleased to that Max Rims will be joining us again this year as usually is going to be talking about the state of privacy because this is very adjacent to the whole identity thing.
And I think with the increased use of AI and smart app privileges and the sort of arrival of deep seek on the set on the scene and obviously everybody will know about the UK government's attempt to compel Apple to implement a surveillance backdoor silently. I'm sure he'll probably talk about that and other sort of developments on the on the privacy front.
So yeah, that'll be that'll be good. I'm glad that he's going to be joining us right now. I think that is an aspect that is always underestimated and then cannot be overestimated because everything that we do relies on the principles of privacy of proper governance of proper compliance to regulatory requirements. I think this is this is the foundation line and we cannot go beyond that. So having Max again there that will be really interesting other keynotes to mention.
Well, the one of the ones that I'm the most excited about is that we were able to get Fulke Schimmel who is the head of the global data service of the UN Refugee Agency the UNHCR. And I think this is a really good topic to have it at this conference this year because it's looking at the topic of I am as the keystone for the UNHCR's next generation. Systems so it's all about I am relevance in globally decentralized politically sensitive and critical scenarios. So this is about moving from national to transnational ecosystems.
So there's that word again ecosystems and the UNHCR is currently in the process of launching a next generation digital ID systems for refugees. And I think what makes this interesting is that it's been done in an extremely complex technological operational and political situations. And these also need to interoperate with national subnational and other systems that are going increasingly digital. So apparently they're dealing with more than 120 million displaced people in more than 130 countries. So they've launched two initiatives this year.
One is called the digital gateway, which is where refugees can access themselves directly for information and services. And then the other one is an interoperability gateway, which enables governments to establish interoperability between their national ID systems and the UNHCR refugee ID data. So both these systems are being currently implemented across Africa the Americas and Asia and this involves international agencies national governments and the identity industry to come together globally.
So that's why I think they were keen to to attend EIC this year is to kind of interact with the identity industry and and sort of, you know, see what what can be done in terms of collaboration. So that in this context the UNHCR is in touch with the stakeholders and the service providers so that digital identity innovations can benefit refugees and then that kind of picks up on inclusivity in identity, which is another key topic, which I know is close to your heart. Absolutely. I think as long as an identity is only somebody who's tech savvy anyway, it is not an ecosystem.
We need to make sure that everybody is able to use identity management for their individual purposes, independent of age, gender, any types of diversity or disabilities or whatever you can think of it needs to be an ecosystem that serves everybody independent of everything that I've mentioned before. This is, as you said, really close to me, because a system that's only for 20% to know how to deal with smart cards is not a, it's not an identity management system that's real life capable. So this is really what I'm looking forward to.
So the UNHCR presentation is really something I'm looking forward to but all the aspects that you've mentioned regarding inclusivity. This is this is something where we need to make sure that these ecosystems serve all and anyone interested in in that topic will also be keen to know that that in the streams we have presentations on technology as an enabler not a barrier for inclusion. Then we have a presentation on identity exclusion what that means and sort of what we need to do about it.
And then there's also one on identity poverty, which you've been kind of mentioned just now and it's it's about identity poverty becoming increasingly understood as a problem for refugees. But there's also for people without a fixed address and it kind of affects people who are like carers or anyone who changes their name from people who get married to trans people. And so there's going to be a session dedicated to can look in how to make identity verification work for everyone and not not just those who are in the kind of the kind of tech savvy group as you mentioned.
And then of course, as I said security is a is a huge thing. So we've got Max in deal and anyone who was at cyber revolution in Frankfurt last December will know what a great presentation he gave and so I was really keen for him to return to speak again at EIC. And so he's he's one of Germany's top Caesars and he's teamed up with information security officer Julian Schwartzkopf to talk about the future of identity and access management. So that should be interesting is looking I'm looking forward to to exploring how I am is in conjunction with zero trust digital identity.
Innovation and agentic AI will shape the digital experiences of tomorrow. So that should be one one to look out for and then rounding off the the kind of first day of keynotes is one of the pioneers in the digital identity and personal data empowerment arenas Katrina Dow and she'll be talking right on theme about moving from digital identity solutions to digital identity ecosystems. So there's the word again, and what it will take to achieve scale and interoperability. But then still, you know on the on the topic of of underrepresented people and stuff.
I'm also very pleased that Paul to me who is the co-chair of the digital identity and personal data empowerment arena. Guide which is the global initiative for digital empowerment is going to be at EIC this year and he's going to be talking about empowering digital consumers and this is about the proposal for the next stage of the European digital ecosystem. And that's a framework for supporting the EU initiative to build consumer-driven data.
Markets and to achieve a balance of power between citizens and digital service providers, which I think should be a really good adjacent topic for this year's EIC. Right and I think that's also a beauty of EIC that it's not only technological problems.
Of course, it's all about technology, but how we can use it to build a better future for our citizens. And how to make it accessible for everybody as I said, and to really cover the angles that are usually a bit ignored by other events by other by other companies. So it's really the broader picture which I really like a topic which everybody's talking about and we need to talk about that as well. You've mentioned that already with identity for all. And I think that's a really good example. It's the overall AI topic and I think that's something that will return in several aspects.
So on the one hand, it's identities for AI. So you mentioned NHI, non-human identities already, but also AI for identity management. So how to use AI in improving IAM systems. Is this something that is covered on the one hand in keynotes or on the other hand also in particular streams that you want to highlight?
Well, Max and Julian's keynote will be touching on that, I think. But then obviously, as I mentioned before, there's the AI risks and opportunity stream. So the AI topics include things like redefining trust and authorization for the AI era. I think that's going to be really challenging in the coming years. And then also looking at things like AI in biometric authentication and SX and responsibilities, a whole area that needs to come to some discussion and in the AI driven digital identity era.
And then one thing that I know that Martin Kueping is quite keen on and that he's going to be talking about is the intersection of AI and identity. And he's coined this phrase that he's rather keen on of AI identity and talking around the topic of integrating identity into AI.
And then, of course, we've got AI powered privacy and data protection. And then I'm also very pleased that we've got something on personhood credentials, which is something that's been kind of stirring up quite a lot of discussion on LinkedIn. And this is about the sort of digital proofs that someone is real, kind of a human being, not like a bot or a deep fake or an AI generated entity. So unlike traditional IDs, they don't need to reveal your identity, just that you're a verified person.
So they're an important topic, I think, because as AI generated content and fake identities become more advanced, organizations need new ways to ensure real humans are behind the online world. They need real online interactions, especially in identity, security and trust frameworks. So personhood credentials could potentially play a key role in fighting things like fraud, misinformation and identity abuse across digital services. So that's also something that I'm particularly chuffed about having on the agenda this year. So just coming back to the keynotes.
In addition to all the new bloods that we've been able to introduce, like Max Imbiel and Paul Toomey and Ford Cashimil, we're going to have EIC stalwarts like Ian Glazer and I also mentioned Katrina Dow. Ian Glazer, he's an industry thought leader. He's been presenting at EIC for many years now. And this year is going to be presenting his perspective on putting the four components of modern identity to work, which is about how organizations can evaluate their identity landscape to choose the right tools to build a stronger identity fabric. And then we've also got Dr. Michael B. Jones.
He's, you know, everybody would know he's a leading expert in digital identity authentication standards and privacy enhancing technologies. And so the topic for his presentation this year is so you want to use digital credentials, you're now facing a myriad of choices. So this is him giving his perspective on the different credential options available. So I think that that should be really good and useful for organizations who are planning to navigate this brave new world of digital identity. And then we have a representative of the open ID Foundation the executive director Gail Hodges.
She's going to be speaking on how tomorrow's digital trust infrastructure is being built today. So again, that's on theme of pioneering digital identity ecosystems and then also another adjacent topic. We have Nathan case. He'll be joining us from the US is an enterprise security and cloud governance executive and he's going to be talking about identity and the foundational reality of security. Or why do we trust you are who you are so that kind of will help to bring the identity and the security topics together and then we've tried to maintain it as topical as possible.
So with the intensification of us isolationist policies manifested through these aggressive new tariffs that everyone's talking about and foreign technology restrictions and and shifting diplomatic alignments. It's brought the concept of sovereign cloud to the forefront of business risk discussion. So our colleague Mike small will be exploring how we might be able to do that. The four key risks or arising from the extraterritorial reach of the US laws. And executive authority particularly in scenarios where the US government may override legal contracts.
So he will assess how businesses outside the US can evaluate and mitigate these sovereignty related risks. Absolutely. And I think again, you've shown the breadth of what we can expect from EIC and I hope that we already inspired some people to have a look at the agenda on our website and maybe to take this last minute opportunity to join us in Berlin. So we will be there from the sixth to the ninth. So four pack days, as you said of five, maybe even one more stream of Live Matters and I will be joining for that as well.
It will be on Alexanderplatz, a really great venue and it will be a great city and it will be, I think, a great event. So 6th to 9th of May in Berlin. So if you want to join us, if you're watching this, listening to that, just before the EIC, be there. If you are listening to that afterwards, no worries. You can catch up with everything that we did. All streams, mostly all streams are recorded and can be revisited via playback and videos and so on. So I'm looking forward to that. I'm really looking forward to the not so much technical aspects of things, as you've already mentioned.
Although I'm a tech guy, I'm really looking forward to that. So the breadth is the beauty. Your final recommendation, anything that you want to highlight, maybe a smaller topic that gets never that much attention. Not topic wise because I've covered all the topics that I think are really important, but I think you've already touched on it. Is that a huge topic and how do we handle it? Is there a final recommendation, anything that you want to highlight, maybe a smaller topic that gets nevertheless the biggest stage, anything you want to mention before we close down?
Not topic wise because I've covered all the topics that I think are really important, but I think you've already touched on it. Is that although we are a hybrid conference and that anybody with a full conference ticket will be able to access the content afterwards. I think it's really important to be on site because that's where the magic really happens. It's all the conversations in the corridors over lunch over coffee. That's what makes EIC special and it's the coming together of the identity community. That's important is kind of maybe even more important than the content on the stage.
So it's really important for you guys to be on site and to come and join us in Berlin. Thank you very much, Borek, for giving that insight into the work that you spent, as you said, 10 months, almost a year preparation for EIC. We are close to that. And that means in two months you can start for EIC 2026. Let's wait for that. But for now, we are looking forward to meeting all of you in Berlin at the BCC at Alexanderplatz and really looking forward to having a great event and great conversations.
Again, thank you very much, Borek. Thank you. Thank you and bye bye. Bye bye.
